Cinematography Mailing List - CML
≡
  • Home & Info
    • Home
    • Geoffs Cinerant Blog
    • Info
    • Help
    • Sponsorship
    • Subscription & Donations
    • Equipment Sales CML small ads
  • Camera & Lens Evaluations
    • Motion Picture Cameras UHD versions
      • Alexa SXT RAW UHD
      • BMD Ursa Mini-Pro UHD
      • Canon C200 UHD
      • Canon C300-2 raw UHD
      • Canon C700 raw 4K UHD
      • Panasonic Varicam Pure UHD
      • Panasonic Varicam LT & Odyssey UHD
      • RED Helium UHD
      • Sony F55 UHD
      • Sony F65 UHD
      • Sony Venice 4K and 6K
    • Motion Picture Lenses
      • Anamorphic Lenses
        • Hawk VLite
        • Hawk Flare
        • Hawk 1.3 anamorphic
        • Cooke Anamorphic
      • Prime Lenses
        • Arri Master Primes
        • Arri Ultra Primes
        • TLS Cooke S3
        • Cooke S4 Mini
        • Cooke S4
        • Cooke 5i
        • Illumina Coated
        • Illumina Uncoated
        • Leica Summilux
        • Leica Summicron
        • Panavision Primo
        • Schneider Xenar
        • Zeiss CP2
      • Zoom Lenses
        • Angeniuex Optimo 15-40mm
        • Arri Alura 15.5 to 45mm
        • Canon 15.5 to 47mm
        • Canon 17 to 120mm
        • Fujinon Cabrio ZK 19 to 90mm
        • Zeiss CZ2 15 to 30mm
    • ACES on a low budget shoot
    • ACES LUT's for use in a non-ACES environment
    • Autofocus for an entire movie
    • Alexa skin - 4 stops over and back
    • Skin - Alexa - 435/5219
    • All Camera and Lens evaluation from 2000 onwards
  • Discussions
    • Edited Collection
      • Timeless Basics
      • Digital Cameras
      • Film Cameras
      • Lenses
      • Lighting
      • General Techniques
      • Working Practise
      • VFX & SFX
      • Post
      • 3D
      • SD Video
    • Announcements
    • AC
    • Chat
    • Film
    • General Cinematography
    • Lenses & Filters
    • Lighting & Grip
    • Mentor
    • Post-VFX-ACES
    • RAW, Log 4K etc
    • Sales
    • Discussion List Help
    • Conditions of Membership
  • Latest
    • Geoffs Blog - CineRant
    • Apple ProRes Raw and Raw HQ
    • Panasonic GH5S mounted on Vehicles?
    • Changes in framing because of changes in business model of studios
    • Comparison of Spherical and Anamorphic at various SensorSizes
    • Depth of Field question
    • How much colour control do you want in a lamp?
    • Data wrangling oddity
    • Filming Ice Skating
    • 35mm projection in Los Angeles and New York
    • Sexism in film crews
    • UNCOATED Filters fo cinematography
    • Mid-level cine prime recommendations
    • ACES LUT's for use in a non-ACES environment
    • HDR monitoring on set
    • TVLogic 055A oled VS SmallHD 702 Bright

 

Aliasing With Bright Red Edges

>Published : 10th June 2005

>Someone recently showed me a snapshot of a scene in which a man is wearing a bright red tie. Everything about the image looked fine except the edges of the tie exhibited extreme stair-stepping. I've seen this, though not that often, in other images as well and experienced it when I was playing around with painting a Varicam and pulled out the red and green and pumped up the blue.

>The shot I first mentioned however was shot straight. Any ideas what's going on here?

>I know red has a tendency to smear, but the heavy aliasing really surprised me.

>Dan Coplan
Cinematographer / DIT
www.dancoplan.com


>Dan Coplan wrote :

>A bright red tie. Everything about the image looked fine except the >edges of the tie exhibited extreme stair-stepping.

>G’day Dan,

>I was just looking at some footage this afternoon that had the same issue. The difference being it was MiniDV. I have seen this before on other Mini DV productions and have always assumed it was *undocumented feature* of the format. Compression ? It's almost like the compressor can't deal with the red and you end up with chunky macro clocks of artifact, especially when the camera is moving.

>Although the shot I saw it on this arvo was a DVX100a shot, I've also seen it on Canon XL's. Is the Varicam using DCT compression like the other DV formats ? Perhaps it's a DCT compression artifact ???

>John Brawley
DOP
Melbourne Australia
www.viciousmedia.com


>Everything about the image looked fine except the edges of the tie >exhibited extreme stair-stepping.

>I'm assuming this was 4:1:1 or 4:2:0 footage? That would be the chroma information being sampled at a lower frequency and showing its particular drawbacks. DV can also have a tendency to offset the chroma in multi-generational encoding so that might exacerbate it further.

> Is this something that you would see on a monitor during shooting or >only upon playback?

>You might see it in very high chroma contrast situations - especially when it is pure red against a light - or even better/worse - a white background. It really depends on the scene. Furthermore it really matters how you are monitoring your camera. Are you looking at the compressed DV coming through onto a PC monitor, or are you seeing the analog signal coming off the RCA jacks or other connections on your
camera.

>If it is the compressed DV stream (as in using something like DV Rack) then yes - you would see it as the results on screen are the actual DV file. With a field monitor it would probably depend on its quality (better calibrated and quality might show it more), but I don't really know for sure.

>Regards,
Christopher Mills
Visual Fx TD
Wellington, New Zealand


>I should clarify that the red example did in fact come from a miniDV camera, not a Varicam which was what I was messing with when I pulled the green and red and pumped up the blue.

>That would be the chroma information being sampled at a lower >frequency and showing its particular drawbacks.

>Is this something that you would see on a monitor during shooting or only upon playback? Like I said, I just saw a snapshot, I wasn't present during the shoot. I'm assuming, then, that the same would happen if it were a bright blue tie?

>Dan Coplan
Cinematographer / DIT


Sponsored by:-

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • smallg.png
  • lindseyo.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif
  • VMI.gif

 

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • BandH.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif

 

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • sim.gif
  • sim.gif
  • smallg.png
  • lindseyo.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif
  • VMI.gif

 

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • sim.gif
  • sim.gif
  • BandH.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif

 

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • sim.gif
  • sim.gif
  • smallg.png
  • lindseyo.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif
  • VMI.gif

 

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • sim.gif
  • sim.gif
  • BandH.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif

 

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • sim.gif
  • sim.gif
  • smallg.png
  • lindseyo.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif
  • VMI.gif

 

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • sim.gif
  • sim.gif
  • BandH.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif

 

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • sim.gif
  • sim.gif
  • smallg.png
  • lindseyo.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif
  • VMI.gif

 

aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • aces.png
  • 24-7.jpg
  • 24-7.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • ABEL_CML.jpg
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Arri.gif
  • bmd.gif
  • camalot.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • Cooke.gif
  • CW_Sonderoptik_Logo.gif
  • dedo.png
  • bandpro.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dolby.gif
  • dsc.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • eos-c.gif
  • fjs.png
  • fsi.gif
  • k5600001.gif
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • FUJINON.jpg
    Fujinon
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Lem.gif
  • LVR.gif
  • Rosco.jpeg
  • Schneider.jpg
  • sd_logo.gif
  • sim.gif
  • sim.gif
  • BandH.jpg
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • sony.gif
  • TCSlogo.gif
  • Tiffen.gif
  • Varicam.gif
  • west.gif
  • ZGC.gif

© 2018 copyright CML - Cinematography Mailing List all rights reserved