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Double-Perf 16

26th August 2004

Okay, I was recently stumped by a student as I described the differences between regular 16mm and Super-16 film formats. He asked me why double-perf 16mm film stock still exists if both regular and super-16 cameras can run single perf. Are there some cameras that will only run double perf? Is double perf more stable in a TK?

I know there must be an obvious answer that I am overlooking!

Chris Mosio
Cinematographer/Seattle
sometimes instructor

Chris Mosio wrote:

>Are there some cameras that will only run double perf?

Yes. Cameras like the Mitchell 16 are designed for double perf film.

Also, there are some simple tricks that can be done using double perf film, like flipping it end to end to reverse action (shoot with camera inverted).

Jeff Kreines

>why double-perf 16mm film stock still exists if both regular and super->16 cameras can run single perf.

An attractive feature used to be that one could re-spool DP (2R) 400' loads (cheaper / unit ') down to 4 x 100' in one rewind (without having to do a further re-wind required if SP (1R). This hardly accounts for an answer to the question
however!

Dr. David Woods
Holcus Ltd.,
16, John Street,
Kingston Square
Hull
HU2 8DH
UK

Jeff Kreines wrote :

>Yes. Cameras like the Mitchell 16 are designed for double perf film.

Jeff : How many Mitchell 16 mm cameras pulled any film in the last year?

Are there any still being used?

Bill Hogan

>Also, there are some simple tricks that can be done using double perf >film, like flipping it end to end to reverse action (shoot with camera >inverted).

Here's one of mine : shoot subjects reflected in water in rev motion, then flip end to end. Of course, there are $20,000 alternative ways to do this...

Sam Wells

Chris Mosio wrote :

>I know there must be an obvious answer that I am overlooking!

Some high speed cameras require double perf film.

Best,

Anders Uhl
Cinematographer
ICG, New York

Anders Uhl writes :

>Some high speed cameras require double perf film. Also some optical >printers.

But yes, it is a rarity, which is why Kodak only has it as a special order item.

Mitch Gross
NYC DP

A Photosonics Actionmaster 500, for instance, is dual pin registered and only uses double perf. The S-16 version runs up to 360 fps and of course uses single perf. There are other high speed cameras and of course the Mitchell’s too.

Best regards,

John Babl
Miami

>Jeff : How many Mitchell 16 mm cameras pulled any film in the last >year? Are there any still being used?

Since the Space Shuttle is grounded, they haven't shot much, but every time it flies Mitchell’s and Photosonics high speed cameras document each take-off. The belly -button camera that rides the shuttle is probably a Mitchell(could be a Photosonics) I could ask a friend to confirm which one

John Babl
Miami

Bill Hogan wrote :

>Jeff: How many Mitchell 16 mm cameras pulled any film in the last >year? Are there any still being used?

Yes, they are commonly used in lower-end optical printers, and on animation stands.

Jeff Kreines

I am pretty sure that Fuji stopped making 16mm 2R....

Adam Forslund
USA

Dr. David Woods wrote :

>An attractive feature used to be that one could re-spool DP (2R) 400' >loads (cheaper / unit ') down to 4 x 100' in one rewind (without having to >do a further re-wind required if SP (1R)....

Only if you don't care that the edge numbers won't print through on the work print.

Wade K. Ramsey, DP
Dept. of Cinema & Video Production
Bob Jones University
Greenville, SC 29614

Wade Ramsey writes :

>Only if you don't care that the edge numbers won't print through on the >work print.

And that they'll be running backwards.

Brian Heller
IA 600 DP

Wade Ramsey wrote :

>Only if you don't care that the edge numbers won't print through on the >work print.

Yes, that's hardly a reason to use double perf stock.

What I find amusing about this is that a few years ago, Kodak wouldn't supply single-perf Double-X!

Jeff Kreines

Don't the 16mm photosonics cameras need double perf?

Mark Weingartner
LA

Adam Forslund states :

>I am pretty sure that Fuji stopped making 16mm 2R...

Actually Fuji still makes 16mm 2R, however here in Hollywood quantities and types are limited due to demand. Larger special orders would require a purchase order and shipment from Japan but as far as I know there are no immediate plans to discontinue 2R.

Ken Grabot
Fujifilm Motion Picture Division
Hollywood Ca


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