HD-SR For S-16 Bestlights Transfer

I've been hired as DP on a local documentary. The producer want's budgets for HD and Film origination through HD master. I recommended finishing to HD-SR 24p master.

Is HD-SR available in any film labs for S-16 telecine? I have a call into FotoKem. Any rough ideas for hourly rates? Has anybody compared HD-SR transfers to HDCAM or D5? Is the HD-SR quality jump worth it and the added cost? Is D-5 still more cost effective at this point?

Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

Tom McDonnell
Director/DP
New Orleans, La

Hi Tom,

A better question than "Is HD-SR available in any film labs for S-16 telecine?" would be "What's the best format available for the workflow in the DI post process?". It's no use to find a facility that can transfer to SR if the material can't be used in editing/effects/color correct.

If you're working with a facility that can transfer to SR then you can load the SR material into an appropriate 4:4:4 capable workstation then you may see an advantage to that workflow - if not then going with D5 will give you many more options today (may change tomorrow )

Rich Torpey
VP Engineering
Rhinoceros/MultiVideo Group
50 East 42 Street
New York, NY 10017

Rich,

I don't doubt you're right but is there any reason to think HD-SR will NOT become somewhat, how you say "pervasive" ?

Sam Wells

Hi Sam,

I agree that it offers some excellent possibilities - the question is "What will you be doing with it in the timeframe of your project?" You really need to check out what the facility is doing with the material - are they maintaining a 4:4:4 path through the post process or do they go 4:4:4 to 4:2:2 and back? This brings up bad memories of facilities in the 90's that were selling "Digital Editing" - yes they had D-2's or DigiBeta but they were going through Grass 300 analog switchers! That was more common than most will admit and I got into a few discussions as to just how unethical I found it.

The SR decks may well catch on soon and facilities may put in the needed infrastructure to use them (we have much of the necessary gear in place today with more on order) but it's still rare to find the seamless workflow that we wish for. That's why I said "D5 will give you many more options today (may change tomorrow )"

Richard Torpey
VP Engineering
Rhinoceros/MultiVideo Group
50 East 42 Street
New York, NY 10017

>I recommended finishing to HD-SR 24p master. Has anybody >>compared HD-SR transfers to HDCAM or D5? Is the HD-SR quality >jump worth it and the added cost? Is D-5 still more cost effective at this >point?

It sounds to me like it might be worth the cost to master to the SR machine IF and ONLY IF your project was shot on film or 4:4:4 electronic capture (such as Viper), AND the ENTIRE post process INCLUDING editing, archiving, and color grading is done with no 4:2:2 conversions, and finally is output in that pristine 4:4:4 condition.

If any of those circumstances should be compromised, then mastering to a 4:4:4 videotape format would be a waste of bandwidth, presuming that the SR is actually, completely compression free and non-bandwidth limiting, a circumstance that has never been the case with videotape recording formats except, arguably, for the D1 format.

GEORGE C. PALMER
HDPIX, INC.
www.hdpix.com

Hi George,

Some minor points - SR is not uncompressed. The data rate off tape is higher than D-5 which means it uses a bit less compression than D-5. The only available HD VTR that is uncompressed is D-6 (Philips VooDoo) and a bit unwieldy for field use (but, if you REALLY want to, I can always make you a deal) coincidently, when in uncompressed mode, the D-6 is 8bit the same as D-1 was in standard definition.

Richard Torpey
VP Engineering
Rhinoceros/MultiVideo Group
50 East 42 Street
New York, NY 10017

>IF the ENTIRE post process INCLUDING editing, archiving, and color >grading is done with no 4:2:2 conversions, and finally is output in that >pristine 4:4:4 condition.

I'd like to chime in and agree with George Palmer on this one, and add that re-sampling to 4:2:2 lurks around every Post Production corner. I recently had my 4:4:4 Viper data resampled by an Inferno!

Dave Stump ASC
VFX Supervisor/DP
LA, Calif.

David Stump wrote :

>I'd like to chime in and agree with George Palmer on this one, and add >that re-sampling to 4:2:2 lurks around every Post Production corner.

Yep, 4:2:2 is a gotcha. Fortunately, affordable 4:4:4 desktop systems are here...if only there was affordable 4:4:4 tape! (I don't think HDCam SR is bad, just wish it were a bit cheaper!)

Jeff "likes working in 4:0:0 as well" Kreines